tv Countdown With Keith Olbermann MSNBC November 17, 2010 11:00pm-12:00am EST
operations, she's going to have to start having to hire staff. she's going to have to a real people she can trust, but designated persons tt are on staff that can really manage a campaign. that's what we have to see first before anything else. >> we'll look for it. alex wagner, thank you so much. >> thanks for having me, chris. that's "the last word" i'm chris hayes in for lawrence o'donnell, he'll be back tomorrow night. you can find more of my work on twitter.com. "countdown" is up next. which of these stories will you be talking about tomorrow? a warning to president obama. we have just lost this election, we need to draw a line, george sorros says at the democracy alliance today. his spokesman insists he was not suggesting another democratic presidential candidate in '12, then what was he suggesting?
with the man who broke the story, sam stein of "the huffington post." dr. harris doubles down. the anti-government health care congressman-elect again demands he gets his government health care now. and the insurance industry plan b from 2007 against the movie "sicko" is revealed. >> push michael moore off a cliff -- >> our guest wendell potter explains they didn't mean that literally. policy ostriches. >> i'll fight every day to keep washington politicians from mortgaging our children's future. >> but congressman steve king and bauchmann won't serve on the house appropriations committee because they would then get blamed for the actual budget cuts. the return of worsts, not really. and another inevitable result of islamaphobia. and -- a senate hearing on junk. a leak of 400 body scans, an apple video on the fiasco, and a
man who designs security saying none of this is necessary nor even useful. the tsa versus the usa over tna. all the news and commentary now on "countdown." good evening from new york, this is wednesday, november 17th, 720 days until the 2012 presidential elections. elections that president obama might have to win without the help of one of, if not the most famous progressive bankroll. the boogie man. mr. sorros saying "if this president can't do we need, it's time to start looking somewhere else." the huffington post reporter who broke the story tonight sam stein standing by to join us.
a top adviser telling the huffington post he did not dispute the accuracy, but they should not be read as a primary challenge to mr. obama. the hungarian-american financier giving tens of millions to election-oriented groups on the left as well as to a new universe of think tanks and media matters. in the course of of this week's annual meeting of the democracy alliance, which matches well-off donors with progressive groups, he reportedly met with a handful of other donors yesterday and said he is "used to fighting losing battles but doesn't like to lose without fighting." quoting again, we have just lost this election, we need to draw a line, and if this president can't do what we need, it is time to start looking somewhere else. some at the meeting, which attracts between 100 and 150 rich democratic donors. it also seems possible he is
instead talking about something obama himself has given the green light to. after having discouraged spending by and donations to third-party democratic groups during his 2008 campaign when he raised staggering amounts of cash in small donations, the president has now opened the field for such groups to play a role in the 2012 race following the citizens united ruling from the supreme court earlier this year that opened the flood gates for anonymous spending from corporations and millionaires directly targeting candidates. one unnamed democratic operative told huffington post "the main concern was about messaging. i think they are frustrated that the president isn't being more direct. the general consensus is that support has to move beyond being about one person, and more about a movement. i don't know if we've moved beyond there." huffington post also reporting that dissatisfaction among fat cat donors was not limited to sorros. the event at why the administration has not stood up
more to republicans. the washington independent reporting some donors are getting restless and looking to create a political spending outfit to rival the network of right-wing groups that revolve. good evening, sam. >> hi, keith. >> how would you characterize with all of the information that's available to you, the message mr. sorros was delivering? >> one person called it sober, not somber. i think it's clearly given way to the recognition that democrats got their clocks wrong in 2010. and they need to reboot. and, you know, one of the things he was trying to convey, and his aides stress it wasn't a need for a primary challenge, there needs to be more of an aggressive stance when they are being distorted by republicans. and if the white house isn't willing to fighthose battles, then he's willing to spend money and put it towards institutions
that will do it. and part of that is media matters, part of that is the center for american progress. but i expect that there's also going to be a rise in third-party outfits. things that carl rove and ed gallespie did. >> if the president can't do what we need, it's time to start looking somewhere else. was it intentionally vague with an undercurrent of other people regarding the presidency? was it a deliberate attempt to both get a message across we need somewhere else in the way of an institution while also suggesting, look, it gets worse, everything is still on the table? >> sure. well, to lift the curtain a little bit. the reason i found out about this is because people interpreted it as if he was hinting at a primary challenge. that's why it was passed back to me. i trust the people around him when they stress dispassionately it had nothing to do with that. i think the gist is just what we explained. he wants an institution that can do the sort of pushback rapid response that this white house
has largely neglected. keep in mind, there's an important context here. in 2008, when the obama campaign went to the democracy lines, they basically said funnel all your money through our campaign, our rising tide will lift all boats. and largely that happened. you saw the padding of majorities in the congress, you saw the winning of the white house. i don't think there's a recognition that can take place in 2012. i don't think donors are comfortable with the fact that obama can lift everyone else into political prominence. and so now you see people like sorros and other donors who are really looking for other outlets they think could help the party out. >> if -- if mr. obama has okayed these outside group endeavors, third party is a confusing term when you're talking democrats or republicans. but outside parties, outside groups, and he's leaning in that way and that's what this phrase meant. what degree are they on the same page here? >> legally they can't be on the same page. but i think philosophically, you're starting to see the two worlds get close to each other. in 2008 there was a real concerted effort to put all the
money in the campaigns so you'd have one simple message, and that would solve all the problems. well, it doesn't work that way. and i think in 2010, what people saw was that karl rove was able to create these organizations, basically in the course of one year that were able to funnel money behind a host of candidates and do it effectively. the white house insists they're fine with this provided there's transparency among donors. they want to make sure that everyone who donates to these groups has their names listed. that's their push. i suspect you're going to see a huge amount of proliferation of outside groups not third-party groups because there is angst among the donor class within the democratic party. >> sam stein at the huffington post. thanks, great story. >> thanks, keith. let's turn now to the columnist for the "washington post." good evening to you, e.j. >> how are you, keith? >> not bad. looking for explanations here as usual. did sorros jump hit? threaten to jump hit? is it a warning shot? or is this really has the second-level interpretation seems to suggest?
not about president obama but about these third-party, outside party groups? >> well, you know, i think george sorros is a lot of other progressive activists except he seems to be worth about $1 billion or $2 billion more than a lot of activists. there was a lot of frustration that the election was lost, that democrats and the presidented included didn't carry the argument very well. but i think there is something important about this second-level explanation. i think after 2008, a lot of progressives who had been organizing a lot of different things during the bush years felt, all right, there's a democratic president, a democratic congress, they can take care of things. then they got out-argued and out-sound bitten throughout that period. there is as happens when people lose elections, there is is a lot of looking back and saying we've got to rethink this and do things differently, or else we'll get our clocks cleaned next time. >> how does that news, then,
play inside this white house with this president? >> you know, that's an interesting question. we're going to see a real test in terms of his ability and willingness to draw lines in the whole fight about whether you extend all of the bush tax cuts, including those to really rich people. ironically we're talking about george sorros here. and i think that's going to be a test. i think the white house has had a very mixed at best record in terms of reaching out to a lot of people. it doesn't have to be george sorros. i think you find, at least i've found around town, it's moderate democrats, left of center democrats. you're wondering, do they listen to a lot of voices outside? and i think again, one of the lessons of this defeat, is there going to have to do a lot more outreach and maybe sorros will get a call tomorrow. >> sorros said also he doesn't like to lose without fighting on a day when we're told that max baucus is ready to propose a bill with a two-year extension of all bush tax cuts. you wrote in your column monday about democrats.
let me quote it. imagine the third party still controls, passing the extension of the millionaires but leaving the unemployment in the cold. laugh out loud the next time the democrats claim to be on the side of working people. if the democrats lose this without fighting, and in the case of mr. baucus, technically a democrat, poses the surrender terms. if they're not on the side of the working people anymore, what will they have become? >> they'll become grover cleveland democrats again, john w. davis democrats. there's a lot of stuff floating around. baucus is on record as saying he doesn't think they should be extended for millionaires. so it's going to be very interesting to see what he is actually writing in that very complicated committee of his. maybe we'll take as long on this as we took on health care, and then we won't have to deal with this issue until about a year from now. but i think you also have surprising democrats, dianne feinstein said no, we shouldn't extend this.
let's have a vote on extending it to 250,000. mark warner is saying, you don't want to take that money out of the economy, let's take the money that would've gone to the really rich people and put it to more -- better uses to create jobs, like maybe a temporary payroll tax cut. and schumer proposes you lift it to $1 million, and you're going to have a real fight. are they going to fight for only millionaire tax cuts? there was a sense of a lot of anger on the progressive side after the election that they were going to cave on this. and i think some people are re-thinking. >> e.j. dionne thanks for your time. >> great to be with you. the titles, meanwhile may have changed. the republicans and democrats in the house held their leadership elections today, and as expected, mr. boehner of ohio will be the speaker of the house, two newly-elected members will represent the freshman class. christy nome of south dakota and
tim scott of south carolina. the democrats, speaker nancy pelosi won her bid to be minority leader, steny hoyer will be the whip. jim clyburn will serve in a newly created position as assistant leader. the anti-government health care american who complained he wasn't getting his health care fast enough has a solution to this problem of government health care, give it to congress from day one and screw the rest of you. wendell potter next. >> ( laughing ) >> yay! no! no! no! no! aah! >> that's your water? it's bad water. isn't that right? >> healthcare that goes everywhere. [ gobble, gobble ]
wendell potter on what the insurance industry intended to do to him to discredit the movie "sicko." she and the other deficit hawks talked a great game but so scared is she as being identified with actual budget cuts, she won't serve on the budget-cutting committee. he attacks the president while the fox minnons attack him for saying something nice. "worst persons" is back, not
really. and apple daily cuts to the chase. it will end this way, won't it? well, not if our guest, an expert on israeli airlines can talk some sense into them. ahead on countdown. ♪ [ man ] if it was simply about money, every bank loan would be a guarantee of success. at ge capital, loaning money is the start of the relationship, not the end. i work with polaris every day. at ge capital, we succeed only when they do. whoo! awesome! yes! we've got to get you out of the office more often. ♪ my turn to drive. ♪ ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] some people just know how to build things well.
give you and your loved ones an expertly engineered mercedes-benz... ho ho ho! ...at the winter event going on now. but hurry -- the offer ends soon. last night we told you about the anti-government health care congress-elect who demanded his government health care the day he starts his new job. today the anesthesiologist from maryland attempted to remove the foot from his mouth and botched the procedure. also in our fourth story, more details on the health care industry's covert attempt to submarine the health care reform they promised to facilitate and
explosive revelations from wendell potter who says his own company signa was so scared of what "sicko" would do to the bottom line that they sought a campaign to push michael moore off of a cliff. michael moore has responded, wendell potter is our guest next. yesterday politico reported the account on an anonymous staffer in the room with harris for his freshman orientation. he had campaigned on repealing health care reform. he was allegedly steamed when he found out he had the to wait a month for his government subsidized health care to kick in. today in an interview with fox, dr. harris disagreed with the portrayal of his tone, but not the content of the report, quoting it was a simple question any employee should ask. oh, and by the way, how do i get my health insurance to be seamless? the new lawmaker who previously said there is no constitutionally mandated role, said the best solution would be for the federal government to say, yes, we do provide
coverage. and it's from day one. for him. not for you. today bloomberg news revealing the extent to which insurance companies went to kill the reform that we did get citing tax records and people familiar with the donation. bloomberg reports that america's health insurance plans the advocacy group that represents companies like united health, aetna, and humana funneled money to the u.s. chamber of commerce, which in turn spent that money on advertising, polling, and a grass roots campaign to defeat health care reform. publicly ahip was onboard with health care reform. recall ahip ceo's pledge to the president in march of last year. >> we want to work with you, we want to work with the members of congress on a bipartisan basis here. you have our commitment. >> and then there was the commitment by the health care giant signa to discredit "michael moore." wendell potter writing in his
new book "deadly spin," that moore's documentary inspired politicians to push for universal health care. if moore's movie attracted big audiences and generated a lot of buzz it might elm bolden one or more democratic candidates to join representative dennis kucinich in endorsing the expansion of medicare to cover everybody. the increasingly profitable insurance industry would find itself in a war for survival. potter saying his company contracted a pr firm to quote defame michael moore, to discredit him. to figuratively push michael moore off a cliff. >> but they were doing an investigation into him personally. >> well, absolutely. we knew as much about him as he probably knows about himself. >> about his wife, his kids. >> it's important to note everything that you might be able to use in some kind of a campaign against someone to discredit them professionally and often personally. >> and do you use that? >> you use it if necessary. >> joining me now as promised,
former communications director at signa, and author now of the new book "deadly spin: an insurance company insider," wendell potter. good evening, sir. >> hi, keith, how are you? >> did you use the research on michael moore? >> yeah, of course. but not -- we didn't have to push him off a cliff. that didn't -- that wasn't necessary. and it wasn't just signa, it was the entire industry. and ahip played a key role in funding the strategy in the plan to discredit the movie. >> i should point out you and mr. moore have agreed to appear on this program together jointly for the first time next monday. >> that's right. that's right. >> but tonight, mr. moore has responded at huffington post and disagrees with your contention that the smear campaign was successful. he says his movie did, in fact, bring health care reform to the forefront of many minds, particularly in washington. but he did say their smear campaign was effective and did create the dent they were hoping for, single payer and the public
option never made it on to the floor of discussion. >> he had a good movie. and i think people who saw it with an open mind knew he made a good movie and it told the truth. but he's exactly right, the movie did not have as much of an impact as it might have been had it not been for the smear campaign and the efforts to discredit both moore and the content of the movie. >> and did you -- did i read this correctly that you got stuff from these talking points? from this smear campaign into mainstream representations of moore at "new york times," perhaps? >> oh, absolutely. it was final through ahip into a front group called health care america now, which was received by mainstream reporters, including the "new york times" as a legitimate organization when he was nothing but a front group set up by apco worldwide, a big pr firm that works for both the insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies. it was not anything approaching what it was reporting to be as a
grass roots organization. it was a sham group. >> you mentioned ahip, we'll talk more about mr. moore when you're both here on monday, but the bloomberg report that they spent $86 million to stunt or stop health care reform, you know, in this nightmare fantasy, chairing up -- teaming one the u.s. chamber of commerce, what did they get for their $86 million? >> they got a republican congress, for one thing. and they got a bill that is kind of like the cake. and now they're wanting to eat that cake too. the insurance industry played the obama administration. and they did the same things with the members of the tea party. the tea party might think congress will repeal this legislation, but there ain't that chance because what the insurers like about this is the requirement we all have to buy their products and there's no public option to funnel any of that money away from them. they'll be getting new revenue converted into profits for their shareholders. >> four house democrats signed a letter today asking that
republicans like this congressman-elect dr. harris from maryland who do not believe that government has a role in health care and are largely in congress because that's what they ran on that they should now put their mouths where their money is and opt out of their government subsidized congressional benefits. does the kind of proud hypocrisy of dr. harris and others like him surprise you at all? >> oh, not at all. what we saw during the campaign was demagoguery at its worst. what you see from what harris said is just the way they really are, what they really feel, and what they really believe. >> wendell potter, the former cigna executive. great thanks, sir. >> thank you, keith. >> and we'll see you and michael moore on monday night. >> see you monday. why behind the horror of your choice get photographed naked or get felt up by strangers lies the truth that at the airport neither is actually
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chicken deficit hawks, they demand budget cuts, but won't serve on the committee that does the slashing for fear of getting blamed. the tweet of the day. what is joe miller going to do without government health care? i'm so worried for him. what if he gets an ingrown beard? lisa murkowski is to declare victim any the alaska senate race after the associated press
called her the winner in the race against the beard. let's play "hardball." the police have pulled over a suspected drunk driver. why did they suspect he was a drunker? well, one good indication he put the car in reverse instead of park and after backing into the police cruiser, he attempts again to put it into park. good-bye, car hits an air and water dispenser, but i hope was not a surprise, the driver was arrested on the suspicion of dui. he'll have plenty of time in the big house. on the internet, more people seem to have trouble parking. this one thinks he has a perfect spot next to the entrance, but he tries to get a little too close to the door. once again, brake is not an accelerator. no one hurt by the demolition derby wanna be, although he's regretting his time spent at the school of driving.
finally, with 37 days remaining until christmas, santa's getting a head start by they decided it would be a good idea to dress the animals in the full holiday attire. it was all done as a special treat for the local children. the event went much more smoothly than the one in the spring when they attempted to march the lions around in the bunny outfits. time marches on. michelle bauchmann and steve king calling for budget cuts as long as other people make the budget cuts, next. ordinary craf. we fill them with amazing technology. and we fill them with inspired design. and now your chevy dealer wants to fill them with as much good will as we can. come see how chevy is giving more: right now, chevy's giving you no monthly payments till spring plus 0% apr financing.
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keys ! savings ! ♪ nationwide is on your side ♪ road trip ! it was elwood. after relentless campaigning on it, hitting democrats over the head for it, conning the public into voting against their own best interests over it, why are republicans running away from doing it? in our third story, the gop will not commit to cutting government spending because no one wants to get caught holding the knife. politico reporting that the gop is having an awfully hard time getting members to serve on the
appropriations committee. as one insider tells the website, only one republican formally asked to join the committee prior to the midterm elections, congressman charles djou of hawaii. speaking to the difficulty of making cuts. anybody who is a republican right now come june is going to be accused of hating seniors, hating education, hating children, hating clean air, and probably hating the military and farmers too. so much of the work is going to be appropriations related, there's going to be a lot of tough votes so some people may want to shy away from the committee. i understand it. mr. kingston seeking fellow conservatives to join him on that committee. unfortunately for mr. kingston they declined the invitation. what about the well-known fiscal hawks? steve king of iowa. he's a no.
how about congresswoman michelle bauchmann of minnesota? >> we need to rein in the spending at all levels. and we need to take a look at all of the decisions that are being made. >> she won't serve on appropriations either. okay. so ms. bauchmann won't cut anything. but what about earmarks? is she willing to forego earmarks? >> it's all bad as far as i'm concerned. all this pork is bad. the old pork was bad, the new pork is bad. >> but, in an interview with the "star tribune" of minneapolis, ms. bauchmann decided some pork may be the non-political artery clogging kind. asking for a definition of the word earmark because she doesn't believe that transportation projects like the $398 million bridge to nowhere should be lumped in there. advocating for transportation projects in one's district does not equate to an earmark. i don't believe that building roads and bridges and interchanges should be considered an earmark. there's a big difference between funding a teapot museum and a bridge over a vital waterway.
well, why should she be opposed to a teapot museum? time to call on staff writer for the "washington post," "newsweek" columnist ezra klein. good evening. >> good evening, keith. >> government waste and excess, the thing they made all the noise about the last two years, the earmarks to end all earmarks, this is not actually an earmark? how does that work? >> i'm surprised you didn't know about this, actually. if you look up earmarks in the congressional dictionary, it is spending i don't like. and it's actually very easy to get rid of earmarks when you get into power. you don't appropriate any spending that you like. >> you use the word appropriate, which leads me to appropriations committee. and the one sure fire way to cut spending is to sit on that committee. why aren't these budget-slashing, financial republicans and tea partiers clambering at the chance of these open seats on the committee? >> this is quite remarkable.
appropriations was historically one of the most coveted seats in all of congress. it was considered a very respected position. and then later on, you were the guy who got to dole out or girl who got to dole out all of the goodies. and it was a great way to get reelected. but now back in a place where people are in between the two. you don't want any responsibility for bringing earmarks home, but you don't do it, that's what you're seeing with ms. bauchmann there, and on the other hand, you don't want to be the person with the knife cutting this popular spending. better to sort of let someone else hold the cleaver on this one. you can argue in general for cutting spending, but it's tough to be the one who has to actually do it. >> not that england and america are the same politically. but we've seen this dynamic play out in britain, and it was predicted to the point where some people were wondering if the labor party leaving office
when they did last spring was deliberate so that the lib/dem coalition government would be the ones stuck making the draconian cuts in spending. as that happens, the population of the labor party has gone from nothing back ahead of the other two parties. but with the republicans in charge of the house, how can they exempt themselves from governing and how can they be sure that the democrats won't eventually figure this out and call them out on it? >> well, it'll be two things. one, eventually that committee will fill and they'll do whatever they do. in recent years or history, it hasn't been great and it remains to be seen if they'll be able to make it better now. but because we don't work like england and one party controls everything is actually able to do things, what the republican party is going to do is hide behind the democrats. democrats run the senate, the white house, and when spending doesn't go down, in part because republicans aren't actually cutting it, but in part because democrats don't want to move into austerity in the middle of a deep downturn, they will blame the democrats for the high deficit, you know, even though a lot of it's coming from tax cuts
and other traditional republican priorities here. so it'll be as it sort of normally is. >> you say the committee will eventually fill up. there's a report that the speaker to be. we're hearing from many of the tea party groups that feel that they want to be out front at the slashing gets done. >> it'll be interesting to see if he does it. i would actually quite support that option. appropriations are too big and so much we're seeing hypocrisy on if part of the tea party folks. it'd also be a good thing if not many people are jumping on the committee to get lobbyist funded earmarks here and other types of spending. if one of the byproducts is that speaker boehner can't fill the committee and has to bring it down to size a little bit. i don't think it would be the worst thing in the world. >> ezra klein, thanks for your time tonight. >> thank you. so here it is. not really worst persons returns. and you see what happens, pam? do you see what happens when you promote religious hatred? behind the full-body screening
and touching at airports, the real question, is this fondling necessary? does it even work? apart from inspiring another one of these animated videos. and when rachel joins you at the top of the hour, she'll take a look at why senator kyl wants to put a stop to the missile treaty the russians. [ j. weissman ] it was 1975. my professor at berkeley asked me if i wanted to change the world. i said "sure." "well, let's grow some algae." and that's what started it. exxonmobil and synthetic genomics have built a new facility to identify the most productive strains of algae. algae are amazing little critters. they secrete oil, which we could turn into biofuels. they also absorb co2. we're hoping to supplement the fuels that we use in our vehicles, and to do this at a large enough scale to someday help meet the world's energy demands.
madness at the airports, never to be seen full-body scans leak out. security officials say they won't stop the sanctioned groin groping. and one of the creators of the israeli airport security system explains why it's all pointless. and seriously, fox rips the president for not condemning the "indian chief" who killed general custer? seriously. you see why we're relaunching the not really worst persons in the world? seriously? ♪
> ( engine ine revving )g )er of progresgr take adv advantage of of exced valueslu of aud audi event.t. full-body scans, junk-touching pat-downs, and neither says a true expert in this field are necessary and neither works. first, get out your pitch forks and torches, time for the new and improved "not really worst persons." the not really bronze goes to senator j. rockefeller. he says tv's ailing and there's "endless barking" on cable news. he adds, there's a little bug inside of me that wants the fcc to say to fox and msnbc out and off.
for the american people to be able to count on each other and have faith in the government and more importantly in their future. two things, senator rockefeller has repeatedly volunteered to me that he is a devoted viewer of this program. we're on msnbc, senator. and more importantly, the fcc, the federal communications commission does not have any control over the content of cable television. mr. rockefeller's on the senate committee on commerce which has oversight, so you think he could ask somebody about that little detail. the not really -- okay, we need the other music. brian -- thank you. the not really silver roger ails. he told an online gossip site today "the president has not been very successful." he had to be told by the french and journals his socialism was too far left for them to deal with. giving mr. ailes the final pass,
it is absolutely possible that ailes thinks he's speaking a public opinion and not public opinion he helped to manufacture. on his fox news websites today attacks the president for his new children's book. obama praises indian chief who defeated u.s. general. that's the cleaned up version. the original headline read "obama praises indian chief who killed u.s. general." his most controversial choice may have been sitting bull who defeated custer at little bighorn. seriously, we've reached the point where fox news is still rooting for general custer at little bighorn. how about they go to the memorial and start chanting usa, usa. but our winner pam gellar. when even the laura ingrahams of this world thought the project
was a great example of cultural outreach and healing. gellar insisted it was a mosque. well, there is a problem with it, you may lose control of it and it comes back and attacks you. it spread from an islamic center to protests in tennessee to this moronic anti-sharia law in oklahoma and now phoenix. as this structure is being finished, the new dome visible from the i-10 highway is taking shape and people have been coming up to the builders, the officials demanding to know who let them build the mosque with that funny name la luz del mundo. it's not a mosque, it's a multi-denominational church, christian church. nice work, ms. gellar. now you've got islamaphobes protesting a church. pam gellar, today's "worst person in the world," not
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> it may be the most famous words spoken about u.s. aviation since captain sullenberger said we're going to be in the hudson. our number one story tonight, "if you touch my junk, i'll have you arrested" the plea and warning from unhappy san diego passenger john tyner about the choice between the full-body scan and the way up too close and personal hand inspection. tonight our number one story, why are we doing this? why are we doing this and all of these other remarkably stupid and ineffective invasions of privacy when nations with nearly perfect records against would be aviation terrorists do not? nations like israel? my next guest is an expert on their air security.
first new developments in what appears to be the tsa's losing battle to keep both full-body screening and feeling up passengers alive. tsa administrator john pistole this morning testified and naturally used the worst possible cliche. the bottom line is we need to provide the best possible security. pistole did insist the story of the 3-year-old being patted down is an urban legend. he then added, am i going to change the policies? no. two pilots today, one woman, one man sued over the pat-downs and screenings claiming they are unconstitutional searches. you have by now seen tyner warning a tsa employee in words he could no doubtless sell as a new book title "if you touch my junk, i'll have you arrested." officials told him he had no choice but to leave the airport. he was told he could face the fine of $10,000 if he tried to get away before the security check was complete. the other option, the full-body
scan seems to be only less invasive in a physical sense. and it's brought to you in a deal brokered by michael chertoff. these are some of those full-body scans which the public has been promised will never see the light of day because they are immediately deleted by the machine. that would be them seeing the light of day after they were not immediately deleted by the machine. u.s. marshals running the device reportedly saved 35,000 images of naked court-going americans, 100 of which were released under a freedom of information act filing. the shots were still in the machine when they had to send the machine back for repairs. so your choice. your groin or your privacy. our guest in just a moment. first, this was summed up best as ever by our strange friends at animation crazy website apple daily.
[ s pea ki ng chi ne se ñ] ] >> and joined now by a long-time antiterrorism specialist but also director of security and now runs a security consulting business in new jersey. thank you for some of your time tonight, sir. >> thank you for having me. >> it's not that hyperbolic. are any of these things, the pat-downs, the scans, are any of these things useful? >> no, not at all. the opposite.
if we spend now hundreds of millions of dollars to buy a body scanner only because of the nigerian abdulmutallab who hid the explosives in the underwear and the body scanner is used for pilots that are flying thousands of passengers, and they are the terrorists or they are the suspicious, close the business. >> yes. >> we don't need to spend $1 to buy body scanners. who you are searching -- >> yes. >> only suspicious passengers. we interview every passenger. >> explain that. because it seems too simple when we've had ten years of taking our shoes off and standing in line for an hour. why does it work? and what is the interview consist of? and who does it? >> first of all, we have to understand that people are waiting in line to go to the ticket counter.
while they are waiting in line, this is opportunity for us as security people to go in to interview every passenger. we must hire qualified people. we must train them well. and we need to teach them how to approach with the passengers, to let them understand we are not coming to investigate you, we are not coming to insult you, we are coming to help you, to fly you safe and secure. to go where you go to your destination. this is our responsibility. so please help me to help you. because i'm staying on the ground, you take the flight. >> passenger profiling. you helped to develop it. what does it mean? why does it work? and for people who jump when they hear the word, uh-oh, profiling. who are you profiling? it's not members of an ethnic group, is it? >> no. we are interviewing every passenger with no exception. now, we explain to them what we are doing.
when they understand that we are working for their security, for their life because we are still on the ground and they take the flight, 99.9% of the passengers are honest, and they love to cooperate with you. they know that the united states is the biggest target for al qaeda. we suffered enough from 1988 with pan am. we had technology. where was the technology? zero. september 11th, 19 terrorists, five at each security check point. at logan airport in boston. no one was stopped when they were carrying forbidden items, so we had the technology. why did we spend the money for technology? look at the result of september 11th. but we don't want or we don't know or we don't believe two
words, being proactive. we like to react. after lockerbie, we bombed bolivia. september 11th, afghanistan. and they are telling me that costs money in security here, trillions of dollars we spend now in afghanistan. how many lives of soldiers we lost because of september 11th? look at the shoe bomber. not only we have to be punished. go take your shoes off. now the nigerian guy. he hides his explosive in his underwear. luckily they cannot tell us to go naked to take the flight. so they now came with the system of the body scanner. and look now, the last one the few days ago. yemen. suddenly yemen has a factories that the manufacturer of printers to export to the united states.
no one can think for a second? >> the export/import -- >> what they have to do with this. and they were smart, al qaeda, to laugh at us and to say that the address, synagogues in chicago. when they built the explosive on the way of the united states, the explosive would be exploded and the crew would be losing their life. this is not the security that we want. this is not a security that the american people deserve. it's why we have to drive with this kind of body scanners. i told from day one, do you know what kind of negative reaction we'll get from the muslims? i'm not muslim. but i respect their tradition. >> yes. >> discovering her body from the head to the toe. she goes with the husband or the